Talk:GNMA-XCVII Alvatore
The Alvatore is seen using the claws through its GN Field in episode 25 of S1. It uses them to catch the assault container hurled at it by Lasse and Setsuna. Also I think it is worth mentioning that the Alvatore is also able to fire its mega beam cannon, and all of its smaller beam weapons through the GN Field as well, and with seemingly very little effect on its overall particle reserves. Deadguydrew 02:26, 22 April 2009 (UTC) I doubled checked the footage, when it fired its guns and used its claws, the GN Field was down the entire time.Wasabi 03:39, 22 April 2009 (UTC) Check this video at 50-53 seconds in, it shows it clearly using the claws, extending them through the GN Field. Also at 39-42 seconds it also shows it shooting the beam cannons through the GN Field. I'm also trying to find the screen where it shows the Alvatore firing its big cannon through the field as well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4glGyMngiw Deadguydrew 07:52, 22 April 2009 (UTC) Well the mega beam cannon could only fire through because it could snake pass the field, the claws were also limited in range to go through the field or Alejandro wouldn't bother dropping it from time to time to attack, he could've just put it up the whole time. Suggestively, the field interferes with direct physical contact with the enemy. I might have to rewatch the part when the pincers went past the field, i still don't see it. Last checked, it was because the assault container rammed into the Alvatore to even get ripped in half. Wasabi 10:09, 22 April 2009 (UTC) I went ahead and got hi-res screenshots from episodes 24 and 25 showing both the Alvatore firing its big GN Cannon through the field (not snaking the "tentacle" it was attached to past/through the field), as well the claws being extended clear through the field itself as well. I can also provide other screenshots of the Alvatore firing its other guns through the GN Field as well to support that it is capable of firing the main cannon through its own GN Field with no ill effect. Screen shots are pending, it seriously cluttered the page. How do you link to a photobucket image without wikia automatically inserting it? Fixed. Note the GN Particles from the field in front of the cannon, not behind or around it Different angle of it firing through the GN Field Alvatore after catching the Assault Container Same thing, but with less SFX on screen. Extending the claws through the field from another angle after Assault Container has been destroyed. Same thing with screen clearing More clearing. Same thing still. And this is the clearest shot I have of it from that angle. Deadguydrew 21:44, 26 April 2009 (UTC) Now that we have overwhelming conclusive evidence, how do you wish to proceed? Wasabi 06:20, 27 April 2009 (UTC) No clue, I could fill a profile (some at least) with specs and factoids, but that doesn't make a good wiki. I'll leave that to the pros, I'm only really interested in making sure the information is correct. Deadguydrew 01:21, 2 May 2009 (UTC) Should We Include the Alvaaron's Drive? Well, it has 7 cones at the back of the MA but the Alvaaron has an extra one. Alvaaron profile mentioning that it has a GN Drive on it's own. Or do we count the 7 that are on the sole Alvatore machine? On other pages, we usually work on a "what's on the whole thing" basis. -SonicSP 21:20, October 25, 2010 (UTC) I guess the problem is that we don't really know if the Alvaaron's GN Drive connects to the rest of Alvatore. There are a couple ways of looking at this: *Treat it like the GN Arms, which connect to and use power from the attached Gundam's GN Drive, but aren't listed with said GN Drive as part of thier loadout. Alvatore is said to have only 7 drives. *On the other hand, Alvaaron's beam rifles can be fired while it's on Alvatore, no problem. This way, you could consider Alvaaron to be like a turret on Alvatore powered by its own GN Drive. Alvatore is said to have 8 drives *Or, we could comprimise, and say something like '7 GNT Drives GN[T Drive on connected Alvaaron mobile suit]'. Toby Durr 21:34, October 25, 2010 (UTC) :You wouldn't be a guy I know at another forum don't you? Cos you got what I was pointing at immediately. :Problem now is, the answer "differs" depending on how you define "Alvatore". We have the states number of Drivesfor "Alvatore", we just don't know what it stands for. :I first thought 7 was correct and assumed a Virtue/Nadleeh duality thing but now.....I dunno. I do know that if we were to use the number of visual cones (which are likely Drives....but not 100% necessrily so), the number will eight. There's a total 8 seperate cones on the "whole" thing. 7 on the Alvatore's back and one on Alvaaron. :hmmm, decisions decisions. -SonicSP 21:45, October 25, 2010 (UTC) : :Araxiel on the 00 forums and Animesuki, if that helps. :p :What may be crucial to figuring out the difference between the two units, and thier exact relationship, is: Can Alvatore operate without Alvaaron? As far as I can tell, all the controls for Alvatore are routed directly to Corner's cockpit on Alvatore, suggesting that Alvatore's basically an add-on to Alvaaron of sorts. :It's not helpful if we don't have an exact drive count and are just guessing from the number of cones. It could have one, three, seven, or any number, just with seven exhaust cones... the Ptolemy crew don't give us an exact helpful number like they did when scanning the Thrones' ship, after all. :Toby Durr 21:53, October 25, 2010 (UTC) ::That pretty much explains it, you must have read my posts in Zook's forums. Then you know the issue at hand then. Anyways, the site profile say "7" which is helpful to a certain extent. ::Once you insert the "anything can be a GN Drive argument"; which I did a lot on that discussion, it becomes complicated, very complicated. We have a nice stated number right here, but we do not know what it stands for. ::Any-ways, I think we should treat each cone in this case as a Drive because the likelihood of a 7 Drive on a 7 coned ship is more likely to favor the Drive=cone formula. I know it's never 100% but I think it's strong enough in this case given the probability of the exact same digit matching but not be each other is quite low relative to them not matching. ::We can go 8, but that would go strongly against a "stated text". Even if we have the problem of definition with the profile text, going against one of the meaning seems wrong somehow. ::So I propose the 7+1 solution. Seems good enough to me. ::For those who are curios, the discussion on the fore-mentioned forum can be found with this linkhttp://z11.invisionfree.com/gundam00/index.php?showtopic=351&view=findpost&p=5011310 Take a look of what I said if your trying to figure out what we're talking about. Post your thoughts on the discussion if you have any on the issue of the article. -SonicSP 22:05, October 25, 2010 (UTC) ::I always considered the Alvatore and the Alvaaron 2 seperate "beings", since one is a MA and the other is a MS. Just like how the GN Arms can attach to exia, and then seperate from exia. You would say the Alvatore has 7 GN Drives, while the Alvaaron has 1 GN Drive. I guess what I am saying is that on the page, you would just state it as 7 GN Drives, then on Alvaarons page it would be 1 GN Drive. Dav7d2 01:13, October 26, 2010 (UTC) ::Ah, but we do state the Drive in the GN Arms page although we label it with the Gundam but in the GN Arms page. I think that we should label Alvaaron's Drive separately here as well from Alvaaron's 7. Because that one Drive played a role in the moments of where Alvaaron was inside Alvatore, just like Exia's GN Drive played a role whenever it was inside the GN Arms and fighting. -SonicSP 00:10, October 26, 2010 (UTC) :: ::It's probably worthwhile mentioning that at the time of the Alvatore's production and deployment, GN-T Drives were apparently exclusively self-contained entirely within the cone. It's more likely than not that the seven cones on the back of the Alvatore are all its GN Drives. Toby Durr 19:39, October 26, 2010 (UTC) :::That's always been the case anyways but moreso than but it's still not probably enough to call all cones Tau Drives since some are pretty huge but the ones on Alvatore seems reasonable. -SonicSP 20:13, October 26, 2010 (UTC) Design Comparison of the Alvatore to the Head of an Elephant : Both the Alvatore and Gadelaza look as if their appearancesmay actually have been designed after an elephant's head and not a horseshoe crab and whatever the appearance Gadelaza is stated to be designed after, if anything: :